Legislature(2021 - 2022)BARNES 124

05/02/2022 03:15 PM House LABOR & COMMERCE

Note: the audio and video recordings are distinct records and are obtained from different sources. As such there may be key differences between the two. The audio recordings are captured by our records offices as the official record of the meeting and will have more accurate timestamps. Use the icons to switch between them.

Download Mp3. <- Right click and save file as

Audio Topic
03:16:53 PM Start
03:17:21 PM HB301
04:32:34 PM HB382
04:56:32 PM SB190
05:10:14 PM Workers' Compensation Appeal Commission
05:11:56 PM Adjourn
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ HB 301 UTILITIES: RENEWABLE PORTFOLIO STANDARD TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Testimony <Invitation Only> --
+ HB 382 INSULIN COVERAGE:INSURANCE;MEDICAID TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHB 382(HSS) Out of Committee
-- Public Testimony --
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
+= SB 190 REGULATORY COMMISSION AK/REFUSE UTILITIES TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Public Testimony --
                     ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                 
           HOUSE LABOR AND COMMERCE STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                        
                           May 2, 2022                                                                                          
                            3:16 p.m.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative Zack Fields, Co-Chair                                                                                            
Representative Ivy Spohnholz, Co-Chair                                                                                          
Representative Calvin Schrage                                                                                                   
Representative Liz Snyder                                                                                                       
Representative David Nelson                                                                                                     
Representative James Kaufman                                                                                                    
Representative Ken McCarty                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
All members present                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 301                                                                                                              
"An Act relating to the establishment of a renewable portfolio                                                                  
standard for regulated electric utilities; and providing for an                                                                 
effective date."                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD & HELD                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 382                                                                                                              
"An Act relating to insurance coverage for pharmacy services."                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED CSHB 382(HSS) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 190(FIN)                                                                                                 
"An  Act  extending  the  termination   date  of  the  Regulatory                                                               
Commission  of  Alaska;  relating  to  Regulatory  Commission  of                                                               
Alaska regulations  regarding refuse  utilities; relating  to the                                                               
powers  and  duties  of  the   legislative  audit  division;  and                                                               
providing for an effective date."                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD & HELD                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
CONFIRMATION HEARING(S):                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Department of Commerce, Community, and Economic Development                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     Julie Sande  Juneau                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Alcoholic Beverage Control Board                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     Douglas Moore  Talkeetna                                                                                                   
     Janice Hill  Haines                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
State Board of Registration for Architects, Engineers, and Land                                                               
Surveyors                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Sterling Strait   Anchorage                                                                                                
     Brent Cole  Anchorage                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Board of Chiropractic Examiners                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Walter Campbell, DC  Palmer                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Board of Examiners in Optometry                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Kathleen Rice, OD  Kenai                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Board of Dental Examiners                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Dominic Wenzell, DMD  Girdwood                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Board of Massage Therapists                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     Kelli Shew, LMT  Chugiak                                                                                                   
     Amanda Nosich, LMT  Anchorage                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Alaska Labor Relations Agency                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Paula Harrison  Anchorage                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Marijuana Control Board                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     Bruce Schulte  Anchorage                                                                                                   
     Eliza Muse  Anchorage                                                                                                      
     Ely Cyrus  Kiana                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Board of Marital and Family Therapy                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Tristian Monterastelli  Eagle River                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Board of Direct Entry Midwives                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Hanna St. George  Fairbanks                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Board of Nursing                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     Lena Lafferty  Anchorage                                                                                                   
     Jody Miller, LPN   Haines                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Board of Pharmacy                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     Ashley Schaber, PharmD, MBA, BCPS  Anchorage                                                                               
     Ramsey Bell, RPh  Eagle River                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Alaska State Board of Public Accountancy                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Elizabeth Stuart  Anchorage                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Board of Certified Real Estate Appraisers                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Valery Kudryn  Wasilla                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Real Estate Commission                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Devon (Thomas) Doran  Wasilla                                                                                              
     Chad Stigen - Palmer                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Board of Social Work Examiners                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Gabriel King  North Pole                                                                                                   
     Sharon Woodward  Juneau                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Board of Veterinary Examiners                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Ciara Vollaro, DVM  Palmer                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Alaska Workers' Compensation Board                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     Brad Austin  Juneau                                                                                                        
     Christopher Dean  Fairbanks                                                                                                
     Randy Beltz  Anchorage                                                                                                     
     Matt Martin  City not provided                                                                                             
     Michael Dennis  Anchorage                                                                                                  
     Sara Faulkner  Homer                                                                                                       
     Sarah LeFebvre  Fairbanks                                                                                                  
     Matthew Barth - Anchorage                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Workers' Compensation Appeal Commission                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     Stephen Hagedorn - Anchorage                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     - CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 301                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: UTILITIES: RENEWABLE PORTFOLIO STANDARD                                                                            
SPONSOR(s): RULES BY REQUEST OF THE GOVERNOR                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
02/04/22       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
02/04/22       (H)       ENE, L&C, FIN                                                                                          
03/08/22       (H)       ENE AT 10:15 AM BARNES 124                                                                             
03/08/22       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/08/22       (H)       MINUTE(ENE)                                                                                            
03/10/22       (H)       ENE AT 10:15 AM BARNES 124                                                                             
03/10/22       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/10/22       (H)       MINUTE(ENE)                                                                                            
03/15/22       (H)       ENE AT 10:15 AM BARNES 124                                                                             
03/15/22       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/15/22       (H)       MINUTE(ENE)                                                                                            
03/17/22       (H)       ENE AT 10:15 AM BARNES 124                                                                             
03/17/22       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/17/22       (H)       MINUTE(ENE)                                                                                            
03/22/22       (H)       ENE AT 10:15 AM BARNES 124                                                                             
03/22/22       (H)       -- MEETING CANCELED --                                                                                 
03/24/22       (H)       ENE AT 10:15 AM BARNES 124                                                                             
03/24/22       (H)       -- MEETING CANCELED --                                                                                 
04/26/22       (H)       ENE AT 10:15 AM BARNES 124                                                                             
04/26/22       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
04/26/22       (H)       MINUTE(ENE)                                                                                            
04/28/22       (H)       ENE AT 10:15 AM BARNES 124                                                                             
04/28/22       (H)       Moved CSHB 301(ENE) Out of Committee                                                                   
04/28/22       (H)       MINUTE(ENE)                                                                                            
04/29/22       (H)       ENE RPT CS(ENE) NEW TITLE 3DP 1NR 2AM                                                                  
04/29/22       (H)       DP: TUCK, FIELDS, SCHRAGE                                                                              
04/29/22       (H)       NR: CLAMAN                                                                                             
04/29/22       (H)       AM: KAUFMAN, RAUSCHER                                                                                  
05/02/22       (H)       L&C AT 3:15 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 382                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: INSULIN COVERAGE:INSURANCE;MEDICAID                                                                                
SPONSOR(s): SNYDER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
02/22/22       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
02/22/22       (H)       HSS, L&C                                                                                               
04/21/22       (H)       HSS AT 3:00 PM DAVIS 106                                                                               
04/21/22       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
04/21/22       (H)       MINUTE(HSS)                                                                                            
04/26/22       (H)       HSS AT 3:00 PM DAVIS 106                                                                               
04/26/22       (H)       Moved CSHB 382(HSS) Out of Committee                                                                   
04/26/22       (H)       MINUTE(HSS)                                                                                            
04/27/22       (H)       L&C AT 3:15 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
04/27/22       (H)       <Bill Hearing Rescheduled to 04/29/22>                                                                 
04/29/22       (H)       HSS RPT CS(HSS) 4DP 3DNP                                                                               
04/29/22       (H)       DP: SPOHNHOLZ, FIELDS, ZULKOSKY, SNYDER                                                                
04/29/22       (H)       DNP: KURKA, PRAX, MCCARTY                                                                              
04/29/22       (H)       L&C AT 9:00 AM BARNES 124                                                                              
04/29/22       (H)       <Bill Hearing Canceled>                                                                                
05/02/22       (H)       L&C AT 3:15 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
BILL: SB 190                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: REGULATORY COMMISSION AK/REFUSE UTILITIES                                                                          
SPONSOR(s): MYERS                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
02/15/22       (S)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
02/15/22       (S)       L&C, FIN                                                                                               
02/28/22       (S)       L&C AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 105 (TSBldg)                                                                      
02/28/22       (S)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
02/28/22       (S)       MINUTE(L&C)                                                                                            
03/14/22       (S)       L&C AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 105 (TSBldg)                                                                      
03/14/22       (S)       Moved CSSB 190(L&C) Out of Committee                                                                   
03/14/22       (S)       MINUTE(L&C)                                                                                            
03/15/22       (S)       L&C RPT CS  5DP SAME TITLE                                                                             
03/15/22       (S)       DP: COSTELLO, GRAY-JACKSON, STEVENS,                                                                   
                        MICCICHE, REVAK                                                                                         
03/21/22       (S)       FIN AT 9:00 AM SENATE FINANCE 532                                                                      
03/21/22       (S)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/21/22       (S)       MINUTE(FIN)                                                                                            
03/23/22       (S)       FIN AT 1:00 PM SENATE FINANCE 532                                                                      
03/23/22       (S)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/23/22       (S)       MINUTE(FIN)                                                                                            
03/28/22       (S)       FIN AT 9:00 AM SENATE FINANCE 532                                                                      
03/28/22       (S)       -- MEETING CANCELED --                                                                                 
03/30/22       (S)       FIN RPT CS  3NR 3DP  NEW TITLE                                                                         
03/30/22       (S)       DP: BISHOP, HOFFMAN, WIELECHOWSKI                                                                      
03/30/22       (S)       NR: STEDMAN, WILSON, OLSON                                                                             
03/30/22       (S)       FIN AT 9:00 AM SENATE FINANCE 532                                                                      
03/30/22       (S)       Moved CSSB 190(FIN) Out of Committee                                                                   
03/30/22       (S)       MINUTE(FIN)                                                                                            
04/08/22       (S)       TRANSMITTED TO (H)                                                                                     
04/08/22       (S)       VERSION: CSSB 190(FIN)                                                                                 
04/09/22       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
04/09/22       (H)       L&C, FIN                                                                                               
04/25/22       (H)       L&C AT 3:15 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
04/25/22       (H)       <Bill Hearing Postponed to 4/27/22>                                                                    
04/27/22       (H)       L&C AT 3:15 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
04/27/22       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
04/27/22       (H)       MINUTE(L&C)                                                                                            
04/29/22       (H)       L&C AT 9:00 AM BARNES 124                                                                              
04/29/22       (H)       <Bill Hearing Canceled>                                                                                
05/02/22       (H)       FIN AT 1:30 PM ADAMS 519                                                                               
05/02/22       (H)       L&C AT 3:15 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHRIS ROSE, Executive Director                                                                                                  
Renewable Energy Alaska Project                                                                                                 
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:   Provided invited testimony on HB  301 via a                                                             
PowerPoint  presentation,  titled  "Support for  HB  301,"  dated                                                               
5/2/22.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
JULIE ESTEY, Director                                                                                                           
External Affairs & Strategic Initiatives                                                                                        
Matanuska Electric Association                                                                                                  
Palmer, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION  STATEMENT:    Provided  invited  testimony  during  the                                                             
hearing on HB 301.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
BRIAN HICKEY, Chief Operating Officer                                                                                           
Chugach Electric Association                                                                                                    
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION  STATEMENT:    Provided  invited  testimony  during  the                                                             
hearing on HB 301.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
ALAN MITCHELL, Owner                                                                                                            
Analysis North                                                                                                                  
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION  STATEMENT:    Provided  invited  testimony  during  the                                                             
hearing on HB 301.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
ERIN MCKITTRICK, Co-Founder                                                                                                     
Ground Truth Trekking                                                                                                           
Seldovia, Alaska                                                                                                                
POSITION  STATEMENT:    Provided  invited  testimony  during  the                                                             
hearing on HB 301.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
RYAN JOHNSTON, Staff                                                                                                            
Representative Calvin Schrage                                                                                                   
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  During the  hearing on HB 301, presented the                                                             
summary of changes  made in CSHB 301(ENE) on behalf  of the House                                                               
Special Committee on Energy.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JAMES HOLZENBERG, Staff                                                                                                         
Representative Liz Snyder                                                                                                       
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  During the  hearing on HB 382, explained the                                                             
change made in CSHB 382(HSS)  on behalf of Representative Snyder,                                                               
prime sponsor.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
LORI WING-HEIER, Director                                                                                                       
Division of Insurance                                                                                                           
Alaska   Department   of   Commerce,  Community,   and   Economic                                                               
Development                                                                                                                     
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION  STATEMENT:    During  the  hearing  on  CSHB  382(HSS),                                                             
answered questions.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
LAURA KELLER                                                                                                                    
American Diabetes Association                                                                                                   
Phoenix, Arizona                                                                                                                
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of CSHB 382(HSS).                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
ROBERT "BOB" PICKETT, Chair                                                                                                     
Regulatory Commission of Alaska                                                                                                 
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION  STATEMENT:    During  the  hearing  on  CSSB  190(FIN),                                                             
answered questions.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
STUART GOERING, Assistant Attorney General                                                                                      
Commercial, Fair Business and Child Support Section                                                                             
Civil Division (Anchorage)                                                                                                      
Department of Law                                                                                                               
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION  STATEMENT:    During  the  hearing  on  CSSB  190(FIN),                                                             
answered questions.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR ROBERT MYERS                                                                                                            
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Answered a  question as the prime sponsor of                                                             
CSSB 190(FIN).                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                              
3:16:53 PM                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  ZACK  FIELDS  called   the  House  Labor  and  Commerce                                                             
Standing   Committee    meeting   to    order   at    3:16   p.m.                                                               
Representatives  Snyder, Nelson,  McCarty, Spohnholz,  and Fields                                                               
were present at  the call to order.   Representatives Schrage and                                                               
Kaufman arrived as the meeting was in progress.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
          HB 301-UTILITIES: RENEWABLE PORTFOLIO STANDARD                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:17:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS announced that the  first order of business would                                                               
be HOUSE BILL  NO. 301, "An Act relating to  the establishment of                                                               
a renewable portfolio standard  for regulated electric utilities;                                                               
and providing for an effective  date."  [Before the committee was                                                               
CSHB 301(ENE).]                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS opened invited testimony.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
3:17:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHRIS ROSE,  Executive Director, Renewable Energy  Alaska Project                                                               
(REAP), provided  invited testimony  on HB  301 via  a PowerPoint                                                               
presentation  titled "Support  for  HB 301,"  dated  5/2/22.   He                                                               
turned to  the second slide  and noted  that REAP is  a statewide                                                               
nonprofit  organization   that  has   been  working   to  promote                                                               
renewable energy and  energy efficiency since 2004.   He moved to                                                               
the third  slide, "REAP Education  & Programs," and  related that                                                               
REAP  has multiple  education programs  in both  urban and  rural                                                               
Alaska,   including   science,   technology,   engineering,   and                                                               
mathematics  (STEM)   education  in   the  schools   so  children                                                               
understand where  their energy  comes from, as  well as  work for                                                               
development  to  make sure  there  are  people  in the  state  to                                                               
operate,  maintain,  and  optimize renewable  energy  and  energy                                                               
efficiency projects into the future.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROSE showed the fourth  slide, "REAP Advocacy," and recounted                                                               
that  REAP has  been  involved  in advocacy  since  2008 when  it                                                               
helped pass the Renewable Energy  Fund, for which the legislature                                                               
has  appropriated  $275  million  to date  for  renewable  energy                                                               
projects around the state.   More recently, REAP supported Senate                                                               
Bill 123, Railbelt Grid Reform,  which passed [in 2020] to create                                                               
the first electric reliability organizations  in the state, which                                                               
will affect the Railbelt.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROSE spoke  to the fifth slide, "Why the  Railbelt Needs More                                                               
Renewable Energy."   He  said the  Railbelt needs  more renewable                                                               
energy because  the region is dangerously  [80 percent] dependent                                                               
on one,  high-priced fuel   Cook  Inlet natural gas.   Because of                                                               
that, he stated, the Railbelt's  electricity rates are very high,                                                               
about  twice as  much is  paid  for Cook  Inlet gas  as Lower  48                                                               
utilities pay  for their gas.   He pointed out that  the Railbelt                                                               
has  renewable energy  resources, including  wind, solar,  hydro,                                                               
geothermal, biomass, and tidal.   He further pointed out that the                                                               
Railbelt has  a history of inaction,  it took about 40  years for                                                               
SB 123 to  pass to create a mechanism for  the Railbelt utilities                                                               
to work together.  The Railbelt  has no energy policy that really                                                               
focuses on  ensuring that Railbelt  consumers are  protected, Mr.                                                               
Rose continued,  so SB 123 did  a lot by creating  a mechanism to                                                               
ensure that  regional planning will  be done  in the future.   If                                                               
passed, HB 301  would be executed through  that regional planning                                                               
process, he explained.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROSE  proceeded to the  sixth slide, "Declining Wind  & Solar                                                               
Prices Compared  to Natural Gas."   He  said the graph  shows how                                                               
quickly solar  and wind prices  have come down, with  solar (gold                                                               
line) coming  down about 90  percent over  the last 10  years and                                                               
wind  (blue  line)  coming  down  about  70  percent.    He  drew                                                               
attention to  the average cost  of natural gas (dotted  line) and                                                               
noted that  wind and solar  are now competitive with  natural gas                                                               
in  the Lower  48.   He reiterated  that about  twice as  much is                                                               
being paid for  Cook Inlet gas and said a  strong argument can be                                                               
made that  wind and solar  are competitive in the  Railbelt right                                                               
now.   He pointed  out that  the circles  on the  graph represent                                                               
individual  contracts  between  utilities and  independent  power                                                               
producers and the bigger the circle the bigger the contract.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:21:42 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SPOHNHOLZ,  regarding  declining wind  and  solar                                                               
prices, noted that  a federal tax credit has helped  make solar a                                                               
lot less costly  for Americans.  She offered her  belief that the                                                               
credit expires  in 2024, and  asked whether an extension  of this                                                               
credit has been introduced federally.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROSE replied that there  have been discussions in Congress to                                                               
continue to  extend the production tax  credit, but as of  now he                                                               
doesn't know of any package that it is in.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROSE resumed his presentation  and addressed the bar graph on                                                               
the  seventh   slide,  "Levelized  Cost  of   Energy  Comparison                                                                
Unsubsidized Analysis."   He explained  that this  analysis, done                                                               
every  year   by  the  consultant  group   Lazard,  compares  the                                                               
unsubsidized cost of all different  energy resources.  He related                                                               
that the cost of renewable  energy resources, solar and wind, are                                                               
roughly $30,  $28, and $26  a megawatt  hour (MWh), which  is now                                                               
the cheapest unsubsidized electricity that  can be produced.  For                                                               
conventional  resources,  he continued,  the  cost  from a  fully                                                               
depreciated nuclear plant is $29/MWh  while the cost from a newly                                                               
built  nuclear plant  would  be $130-$204/MWh;  the  cost from  a                                                               
fully depreciated combined  cycle natural gas plant is  as low as                                                               
$24/MWh while the cost from  a newly built combined cycle natural                                                               
gas plant would  be $45-$74/MWh.  The Railbelt,  he specified, is                                                               
producing Cook Inlet gas closer to the price of $74.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROSE displayed the eighth  slide, "Net electricity generation                                                               
from  wind and  other sources  in  selected states  (2020)."   He                                                               
pointed out  that 20 percent  of all the electricity  received in                                                               
Texas is  now from wind  and that  58 percent of  all electricity                                                               
produced in Iowa is wind power.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROSE discussed the nineth  slide, "Declining Costs of Lithium                                                               
Ion Batteries."  He said an  important part of the picture is the                                                               
cost  of energy  storage, at  least  in the  cost of  lithium-ion                                                               
batteries.    A sharp  decline  is  being  seen  in the  cost  of                                                               
lithium-ion  batteries;  a  large  driver for  that  is  electric                                                               
vehicles,  but  other  consumer products  are  using  lithium-ion                                                               
batteries  thereby  creating  a  greater  economy  of  scale  and                                                               
driving the price down.  The  price of energy storage is expected                                                               
to continue  going down, he  continued, which can  help integrate                                                               
variable renewables like wind and solar.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROSE turned to the  tenth slide, "Sources of U.S. electricity                                                               
generation, 2020."   He  specified that  renewables are  about 20                                                               
percent of  the current  mix, with  the percentage  increasing as                                                               
the price of these resources goes down.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROSE spoke  to the eleventh slide, "Renewable  & Clean Energy                                                               
Standards."  He  explained that the map depicts  the states where                                                               
there are already either renewable  energy portfolio standards or                                                               
clean energy  standards.  Thirty states  have renewable portfolio                                                               
standards, which  is what  HB 301  started out  as, he  said, and                                                               
five states  have clean  energy standards.   These  standards, he                                                               
added, drive the portfolios toward more clean energy.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
3:26:13 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ROSE  proceeded  to  the twelfth  slide,  "The  Railbelt  is                                                               
Dangerously  Dependent on  High-Priced Cook  Inlet Natural  Gas."                                                               
He reiterated that the Railbelt's  portfolio is heavily dependent                                                               
on just one resource and noted  that that resource is provided by                                                               
a virtual monopoly, Hilcorp.   He further noted that the Railbelt                                                               
doesn't have  a lot of factors  that are going to  see its prices                                                               
drop:  demand  is flat, production costs in Cook  Inlet are high,                                                               
infrastructure is  aging, and  the state  gas subsidies  for Cook                                                               
Inlet are now unsustainable.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ROSE moved  to the  thirteenth slide,  "Published Prevailing                                                               
Values for  Cook Inlet Gas  ($ per  MCF)," a graph  depicting the                                                               
price of Cook Inlet natural gas from  1994 to 2022.  He said Cook                                                               
Inlet gas  is now  in the  range of $8  [per thousand  cubic feet                                                               
(MCF)], while the  Henry Hub price in the Lower  48 is around $4,                                                               
which went up  significantly in the last year.   [The Railbelt's]                                                               
natural gas prices are very  high despite being produced in-state                                                               
because of the very small market.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ROSE reviewed  the  fourteenth  slide, "Renewable  Portfolio                                                               
Standard Assessment for Alaska's Railbelt."   He related that the                                                               
governor asked  the National  Renewable Energy  Laboratory (NREL)                                                               
to  look  at  whether  80   percent  renewables  by  2040  was  a                                                               
possibility.   The  NREL study  found  two things:   1)  Multiple                                                               
pathways exist  for the  Railbelt to  achieve 80  percent without                                                               
impacting  the  reliability  of  the   grid;  2)  An  80  percent                                                               
[renewable portfolio  standard (RPS)]  will save  consumers $400-                                                               
$500 million  a year in natural  gas fuel prices.   But, he said,                                                               
the next question i:  How much will it cost to get there?                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR.   ROSE   turned   to  the   fifteenth   slide,   "Preliminary                                                               
Benefit/Cost Analysis  of NREL's RPS  Scenario 3."   He explained                                                               
that  Alan   Mitchell  of  Analysis   North  did   a  preliminary                                                               
benefit/cost   analysis  of   NREL's   Scenario   3  using   very                                                               
conservative assumptions.   He said  Mr. Mitchell found  that the                                                               
capital cost of  getting to 80 percent wind and  solar along with                                                               
a little  bit of  hydro would  be $3.2  billion compared  to $6.7                                                               
billion of fuel cost savings, a 2:1 ratio of savings.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROSE  showed the sixteenth  slide, "A New Railbelt  ERO Would                                                               
Execute HB 301."   He pointed out that Senate  Bill 123, the bill                                                               
passed two  years ago, now has  created a mechanism to  execute a                                                               
policy like this.  He stated he  is part of a group that has been                                                               
meeting for the  last two years to develop an  application to the                                                               
Regulatory  Commission of  Alaska (RCA),  which was  submitted at                                                               
the end of  March.  If the RCA certificates  that group, he said,                                                               
it  would  become  the first  electric  reliability  organization                                                               
(ERO)  in  Alaska,  and  the   group  would  be  required  to  do                                                               
integrated resource  planning for the entire  region, which would                                                               
do technical  and economic  feasibility on  a range  of portfolio                                                               
options.  So, he continued,  if the legislature specified a goal,                                                               
then the ERO would do the  analysis to find the portfolios to get                                                               
there.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:29:42 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ROSE   suggested  three   amendments  for   the  committee's                                                               
consideration.  First, he said,  is the initial requirement of 25                                                               
percent by 2030.  The original  bill, he noted, had a requirement                                                               
in 2025  and then 30 percent  by 2030.  He  suggested moving that                                                               
requirement back to 30 percent  and moving the timeline somewhere                                                               
between 2025  and 2030.  He  stated that it is  important to keep                                                               
moving  forward  rather  than allowing  complacency  and  waiting                                                               
until 2030  before reaching these  initial goals  because getting                                                               
to  30  percent  by  the  next goal  is  possible.    Second,  he                                                               
suggested that  the proposed  fine be  raised from  $20 a  MWh to                                                               
closer to  $50 a  MWh, which  is about  the national  average for                                                               
these kinds of fines.  Third,  he suggested that the clean energy                                                               
credits  scheme  be  reorganized  and stated  that  [REAP]  would                                                               
provide detailed technical comments on that.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. ROSE  concluded his presentation with  the seventeenth slide,                                                               
which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     HB 301 Would:                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
   • Diversify the region's generation portfolio and                                                                            
     increase resiliency                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
   • Displace high-priced natural gas fuel, and save                                                                            
     hundreds of millions of dollars every year                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
   • Utilize local, flat-priced renewable resources                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
   • Not impact reliability on the grid                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
   • Keep Alaska competitive in a fast-changing world,                                                                          
     increase energy independence and meet consumer demand                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
   • Support electrification of transportation and heat                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
   • Create jobs, spur statewide innovation and keep                                                                            
     precious energy dollars circulating in the state's                                                                         
     economy                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
   • Establish a standard that triggers action                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ROSE added  that REAP  believes all  these requirements  are                                                               
achievable even faster than the current legislation requires.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
3:33:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JULIE ESTEY, Director, External  Affairs & Strategic Initiatives,                                                               
Matanuska Electric Association  (MEA), provided invited testimony                                                               
during the hearing  on HB 301.  She concurred  with Mr. Rose that                                                               
diversifying the  energy portfolio is  an important step  for the                                                               
Railbelt.   She stated that  utilities in the Railbelt  have been                                                               
very clear in  actions and testimony that  they support effective                                                               
policy for  creating a  diversified energy  portfolio.   She said                                                               
surveys  show  that  70-80  percent  of  MEA's  members  in  this                                                               
conservative  district  want some  sort  of  carbon reduction  or                                                               
renewable   energy   portfolio,   but   this   support   declines                                                               
significantly when  members are asked  about the effect  on rates                                                               
or  reliability.   So, she  continued,  what MEA  hears from  its                                                               
members  is that  they are  interested in  innovation and  energy                                                               
diversification, but  they want to  make sure that  MEA's primary                                                               
responsibility  around  reliability and  rates  is  kept full  as                                                               
well.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS.  ESTEY  noted that  MEA's  members  are constituents  of  the                                                               
committee's members, which is why  MEA is before the committee to                                                               
share how  it believes HB  301 can  be adjusted and  smart policy                                                               
made because  the time to  make a transition  is right now.   She                                                               
recounted that  in testimony before  the House  Special Committee                                                               
on  Energy,  Jenn  Miller, CEO  of  Renewable  Independent  Power                                                               
Producer  ("Renewable IPP"),  stated that  the Railbelt  is at  a                                                               
critical time  for transition, the  transition is big,  and there                                                               
should be  no pretending that  it is going  to be easy,  but that                                                               
doesn't mean  it shouldn't be  done; it  means it should  be done                                                               
right and it  starts here with policy.  So,  Ms. Estey continued,                                                               
that is why [MEA] is before  the committee today.  She noted that                                                               
Renewable  IPP  has  brought on  cost-effective  solar  power  in                                                               
Willow and [will soon be doing the same] in Houston.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS. ESTEY offered MEA's belief  that the purpose section added in                                                               
CSHB 301(ENE)  is well written  and clearly  describes attributes                                                               
of  a successful  and sustainable  clean energy  standard.   This                                                               
addition  is appreciated,  she said,  because it  brings everyone                                                               
together  around common  goals.   She  stated  that the  Railbelt                                                               
utilities  before the  committee today  have worked  earnestly to                                                               
revise the  bill to provide  cost and reliability  protection for                                                               
consumers as well  as due consideration for the  realities of the                                                               
Railbelt's current  limited system.   Also, she pointed  out, the                                                               
Railbelt has few  rate payers to spread costs over,  so that must                                                               
be considered in a transition and be part of the plan.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. ESTEY noted  that the goals listed in the  purpose section of                                                               
HB 301  include to minimize  costs [to consumers], a  priority of                                                               
MEA.    While  there  are  many  positive  reasons  to  make  the                                                               
transition, she stated, the rate  impact will be to MEA's members                                                               
so  it must  be done  right to  limit that  impact.   She further                                                               
noted that  the goals  in the  purpose section  of the  bill also                                                               
include to  provide price stability to  enhance opportunities for                                                               
economic  growth, maximum  grid resiliency,  and minimize  carbon                                                               
emissions.   For member-owned cooperatives,  she said,  those are                                                               
all  very important  parts,  each  equal, in  how  this is  moved                                                               
forward.   She commended  the House  Special Committee  on Energy                                                               
and  Chair  Schrage  for  their  efforts to  listen  to  all  the                                                               
stakeholders involved and bring  a committee substitute (CS) that                                                               
has a  significant amount of  support.  She offered  MEA's belief                                                               
that the  bill is very  close to  something that can  achieve the                                                               
goals established in the purpose section.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MS. ESTEY  deferred to Mr.  Brian Hickey  to address some  of the                                                               
topics  brought  up  in  testimony   [before  the  House  Special                                                               
Committee on Energy].                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
3:38:07 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
BRIAN   HICKEY,  Chief   Operating   Officer,  Chugach   Electric                                                               
Association, provided invited testimony  during the hearing on HB
301.   He offered appreciation to  the committee and to  the [the                                                               
House Special  Committee on  Energy and Chair  Schrage] to  get a                                                               
spectrum of  comments before deciding.   He submitted  that there                                                               
will be  an achievable and  sustainable product that can  be done                                                               
in a technically effective way.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR.  HICKEY drew  attention to  page 10,  Figure 4,  of the  NREL                                                               
study,  "Renewable  Portfolio  Standard Assessment  for  Alaska's                                                               
Railbelt."   He said NREL did  not do a reliability  analysis but                                                               
did run  a production  costing model  which tells  whether enough                                                               
capacity is had in every hour a  day to meet load.  A significant                                                               
amount of work  needs to be done to do  the reliability analysis,                                                               
he advised, and NREL was upfront about that in its assessment.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR. HICKEY stated that Section  42.05.785(a) is the large project                                                               
preapproval process from the language  of Senate Bill 123.  Those                                                               
projects, he  said, cannot be  completed if they  are detrimental                                                               
to the  load serving entity  (LSE) achieving its goals  under the                                                               
renewable portfolio standard (RPS).   That section of Senate Bill                                                               
123, he  explained, was put  in place  so that local  areas could                                                               
develop  reliability  projects  to meet  local  reliability,  and                                                               
typically  those must  be dispatchable  resources.   However,  he                                                               
noted, wind and solar are  non-dispatchable because they come and                                                               
go when  they come and  go.   Therefore, he advised  that section                                                               
constrains   those  local   regions  from   building  reliability                                                               
projects that  are necessary  and have not  been included  in the                                                               
integrated resource  plan (IRP)  that comes  out of  the electric                                                               
reliability organization (ERO).                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
3:40:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. ESTEY explained  that the ERO was formed in  Senate Bill 123,                                                               
and  the  ERO  brings  all the  stakeholders  -  utilities,  non-                                                               
utilities, independent power producers,  the State of Alaska, and                                                               
consumer advocates -  around the table to  talk about reliability                                                               
standards and integrated resource planning.   The ERO, she noted,                                                               
has an  independent staff  that will  help in  coming up  with an                                                               
integrated resource plan.   She stated that there is  going to be                                                               
lots of  public process,  lots of transparency,  and lots  of fun                                                               
money to  be spent  coming up with  an integrated  resource plan.                                                               
She said  she agrees  with Mr.  Rose's statement  that that  is a                                                               
natural place for these two  efforts to merge, but qualified that                                                               
she agrees with him  on a different level.  There  is going to be                                                               
lots   of  conversation,   transparency,  and   involvement,  she                                                               
reiterated, and  having a clean  energy standard out in  front of                                                               
that basically gives that group the  answers, and that is one way                                                               
for policy members to impact  that.  Since a previous legislature                                                               
has  already  impowered  that  group   of  stakeholders  to  come                                                               
together as  approved by the RCA  and come up with  an integrated                                                               
resource  plan, she  continued,  one suggestion  is  to have  the                                                               
current  goals perhaps  confirmed by  a feedback  loop from  that                                                               
process back  into policy.   That is something to  consider while                                                               
going through this process, she said.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS. ESTEY  pointed out that  there was no real  economic analysis                                                               
in the NREL study because NREL did  not have the time or scope to                                                               
do so.   She offered support  for a second phase  of NREL studies                                                               
to help confirm  the numbers and economics.  She  noted that NREL                                                               
did do an analysis of the  potential fuel savings but the cost to                                                               
achieve  those  was not  included.    Mr. Mitchell's  preliminary                                                               
benefit/cost analysis  was a great  start, she continued,  but it                                                               
would be  good to  have further  conversation and  vetting around                                                               
that.   She related  that the utilities  started doing  their own                                                               
economic  analysis  but realized  that  it  probably wouldn't  be                                                               
credible.  She  therefore suggested having NREL do  a similar and                                                               
more in-depth analysis  than Mr. Mitchell's given  that NREL does                                                               
this for other places all the time.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR. HICKEY  informed the committee that  significant transmission                                                               
investment in  the Railbelt  will be  required to  move renewable                                                               
power from one location to another.   He said there are currently                                                               
two transmissions lines  that tie the three areas  together.  The                                                               
Anchorage  and   the  Kenai  line,  owned   by  Chugach  Electric                                                               
Association,  moves about  75 megawatts,  he specified,  which is                                                               
about 10  percent of  the peak  load of  the Railbelt.   It  is a                                                               
single  contingency line,  he explained,  so  when it  is out  of                                                               
service there  is no  access to  [the Bradley  Lake Hydroelectric                                                               
Project] resources.  Nor, he  added, would Chugach have access to                                                               
[the proposed Dixon Diversion Hydro  Project ("Dixon Creek"], nor                                                               
would Chugach  be able to  carry the  energy from Dixon  Creek on                                                               
that  line.    Responding  to Co-Chair  Spohnholz,  he  said  the                                                               
proposed Dixon project is located  near the Bradley Lake facility                                                               
on the Kenai Peninsula on Kachemak Bay.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. HICKEY said the [second  transmission line] from Anchorage to                                                               
Fairbanks carries  about 80  megawatts, about  10 percent  of the                                                               
peak flow, and  it is a single contingency line  that is going to                                                               
cost a fair  amount of money.  Federal  infrastructure funding is                                                               
actively being sought  for this, he related, and  it is important                                                               
to pass  HB 414 and  SB 241 to  give the Alaska  Energy Authority                                                               
(AEA) the  receipt authority  for federal  funds from  the [2021]                                                               
Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act (IIJA).                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
3:45:50 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FIELDS asked  whether those  provisions of  SB 414  are                                                               
included in the current Senate  Finance Committee CS which rolled                                                               
in many provisions of SB 414.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR. HICKEY replied that they were,  but he doesn't know about the                                                               
current [CS].                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR. HICKEY  resumed his testimony.   He said that in  addition to                                                               
federal  funding and  utility contributions  it  is likely  there                                                               
will have to be state funding for some of the transmission.                                                                     
Building  out that  level of  transmission could  be done  by the                                                               
utilities, he  stated, but  it would  result in  significant rate                                                               
increases, so it  is really beyond the  financial capabilities of                                                               
the Railbelt at this point.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS.  ESTEY interjected  that [the  utilities]  disagree with  any                                                               
statements that  $20 per  MWh is  not a steep  enough fine.   She                                                               
said the  utilities are nonprofit  cooperatives that do  not have                                                               
shareholders from which  to grab fine payments.   The fines would                                                               
be paid by cooperative members  somehow, whether through rates or                                                               
through margins, which are the  capital credits.  She pointed out                                                               
that any  fine, especially one at  $20 per MWh, would  be paid on                                                               
top of  the large  amount that the  utilities are  already paying                                                               
for gas-powered  generation.   So, she continued,  a fine  of $20                                                               
per MWh  would be more  than an  adequate deterrent for  a member                                                               
owned cooperative.  Many of  the member owned cooperatives in the                                                               
Lower 48 are exempt from these sorts of requirements, she noted.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. HICKEY added that including it  in rates as opposed to taking                                                               
it out  of the  cooperatives' margins is  critical.   He recalled                                                               
discussion in  the House  Special Committee  on Energy  that some                                                               
items  are  not  allowed  in   rates,  such  as  advertising  for                                                               
lobbyists.   He  specified that  Chugach's margins  in 2021  were                                                               
about $9.7 million, so Chugach's  portion of a 30 percent penalty                                                               
for missing  the target would be  $4.5 million.  That  would move                                                               
Chugach into areas  where its bond debt  covenants, which require                                                               
Chugach to collect  110 percent of its margins  for interest over                                                               
interest, would push the cooperative  into a realm where it could                                                               
go into  technical default.   The  RCA is  required to  set rates                                                               
under  AS 42.05.431  that  allow [a  public  utility] to  recover                                                               
costs that are  contracted for in bond covenants;  so, Mr. Hickey                                                               
advised,  there  is  a  dichotomy   there.    The  challenge,  he                                                               
continued, is that this number  is much bigger than anything that                                                               
is  currently  disallowed   in  rates  for  a   cooperative.    A                                                               
cooperative's margins are razor  thin because cooperatives return                                                               
that money  to their members.   Not having it recovered  in rates                                                               
and  trying to  recover it  out  of capital  credits, he  stated,                                                               
could push the utilities into difficult financial straits.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. HICKEY  related that it was  brought up in the  House Special                                                               
Committee on Energy  and in the NREL study  that utilities should                                                               
be able to  put large quantities of wind and  solar on the system                                                               
and shut  down their gas  turbines for extended periods  of time.                                                               
The challenge  with that on  the Railbelt, he explained,  is that                                                               
there are minimum  deliverability takes out of the  inlet to keep                                                               
the  wells producing  natural gas.   The  home heating  sector is                                                               
still  drawing gas,  but as  gas turbines  are shut  down and  as                                                               
deliverability  is shut  down, it  is likely  that deliverability                                                               
will be lost  in the basin, which will increase  both the cost of                                                               
gas and the availability of it.   So, Mr. Hickey continued, while                                                               
this concept  works well at the  one-hundred-thousand-foot level,                                                               
when getting down into the details  it must be figured out how to                                                               
transition off Cook  Inlet natural gas without  losing Cook Inlet                                                               
natural  gas altogether.   This  critical component,  he advised,                                                               
must be addressed in the CS.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:50:41 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS.  ESTEY stated  that the  utilities  have consistently  voiced                                                               
what they  feel is necessary,  such as rate caps  and reliability                                                               
assurances.   She said CSHB 301(ENE)  includes considerations for                                                               
the RCA  to keep  an eye on  that and it  is anticipated  the RCA                                                               
would write  detailed regulations to spell  that out.  It  is the                                                               
RCA's  responsibility   to  look  after  the   rate  impacts  and                                                               
reliability of  the utilities, she continued,  so [CSHB 301(ENE)]                                                               
assures that that is happening.   She related that the regulatory                                                               
commissions in  other places can  adjust the  renewable portfolio                                                               
standard (RPS)  if it  is felt  that the RPS  is going  above and                                                               
beyond what is  needed.  However, she stressed, that  is not what                                                               
is being  asked for  here, it  is just being  asked that  the RCA                                                               
raise its  hand or put  on guardrails.   Currently, most  of [the                                                               
Railbelt's] renewables are above the  costs of producing with gas                                                               
generation,  and everyone  is  banking on  that  shifting in  the                                                               
future.   If  it doesn't  shift, then  it is  the members  of the                                                               
cooperatives who  are holding the  bag, Ms. Estey stated.   Given                                                               
it  is already  the RCA's  responsibility  to look  at rates  and                                                               
reliability,  putting some  guardrails on  what is  acceptable is                                                               
important to  everyone, she continued.   So, the changes  made by                                                               
the House  Special Committee on  Energy are appreciated  and [the                                                               
cooperatives] look forward  to the RCA creating more.   She again                                                               
touched on  the idea of  putting the  feedback loop from  the ERO                                                               
process into  the clean  energy standard.   Regarding  fines, she                                                               
related that  under the current  CS fines  are not allowed  to be                                                               
recovered in  rates.  She  reiterated that  without shareholders,                                                               
cooperatives  only have  rates  and margins  from  which to  pull                                                               
funding.   Margins  are what  is  left over,  she explained,  and                                                               
those  get reinvested  back into  the cooperative  and eventually                                                               
paid  out as  capital credits.   So,  either way  it impacts  the                                                               
members of  the cooperatives.   She expressed  her hope  that the                                                               
committee discusses this further.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS  said he intends  to write an amendment  on that.                                                               
He  stated  that  the  fines  would be  put  back  into  building                                                               
renewable  generation so  it meets  the purpose  of the  bill and                                                               
would be clear to consumers.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR SPOHNHOLZ  noted that a  chart distributed  to committee                                                               
members shows  a significant  decline in  Cook Inlet  natural gas                                                               
usage taking  place over the last  20 years.  She  inquired about                                                               
the number  of years  left for  being able  to reliably  count on                                                               
Cook Inlet natural gas to provide energy to the Railbelt.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MS. ESTEY replied  that her limited understanding is  that it may                                                               
not be  what is called  "behind pipe."   There is gas,  she said,                                                               
but there  would be a  cost for  getting that gas  connected into                                                               
the system and delivered, and decisions  would have to be made as                                                               
to whether those costs are economically worth it.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. HICKEY added that significant  investment of Cook Inlet would                                                               
be needed to  get gas behind pipe and maintain  the gas fields or                                                               
else go  a different  way, such  as [the  proposed Susitna-Watana                                                               
Hydroelectric Project]  and Dixon Creek  to bridge that gap.   He                                                               
said there is solar  and wind that could be used  to fill in some                                                               
of the gaps, so that transition is necessary.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MS. ESTEY added  that that is why the energy  portfolio should be                                                               
diversified.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:55:32 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  SPOHNHOLZ commented  that a  key question  on the  time                                                               
horizon for  the renewable energy  portfolio standard  is looking                                                               
at  where  to make  capital  investments  during the  transition.                                                               
Rate payers  across Alaska are going  to pay one way  or another,                                                               
she  stated,  and  a  question  is  whether  to  accelerate  that                                                               
transition to renewables while trying  to maintain reliability or                                                               
whether  it  is  more  economic   and  worth  the  higher  carbon                                                               
footprint of  developing natural  gas moving  forward.   She said                                                               
she wants  to look at  both versions of  the bill so  that policy                                                               
makers can make a calculated decision for the people of Alaska.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR. HICKEY advised that a  provision in [CSHB 301(ENE)] regarding                                                               
a  levelized  wheeling  rate  for   renewable  energy  creates  a                                                               
conflict  between  AS 42.05.431(c),  which  is  the Bradley  Lake                                                               
exemption.  Bradley  Lake, he noted, would be  considered a clean                                                               
energy resource under this bill.   The agreements for the Bradley                                                               
Lake Project, he said, are not  regulated by the RCA as they were                                                               
exempted under AS 42.05.431(c)(1).   The challenge, he explained,                                                               
is  that a  very complex  set  of agreements  negotiated in  1980                                                               
govern the wheeling and delivery of  Bradley Lake energy.  If the                                                               
current  bill is  passed, he  continued, there  would a  conflict                                                               
between the Bradley  Lake exemption and the bill  that would then                                                               
have to be  figured out.  Mr. Hickey suggested  amending the bill                                                               
to reflect projects  that are built on a going  forward basis and                                                               
leave  projects that  have existing  wheeling arrangements  which                                                               
are very intricate and tied  together and that are very difficult                                                               
to unwind.   That  specific statute, he  added, was  upheld after                                                               
several years of litigation by the Alaska Supreme Court in 2019.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS.  ESTEY  pointed out  that  [CSHB  301(ENE)] includes  a  very                                                               
prescriptive  list of  what things  are acceptable  and what  are                                                               
not.   She emphasized  that it is  hard to sit  here in  2022 and                                                               
know what  should be  on this  list decades in  the future.   She                                                               
suggested that the bill include  a provision for review every two                                                               
to  three years  by  an  independent source,  whether  it is  the                                                               
Alaska  Energy  Authority, the  RCA,  or  the Alaska  Center  for                                                               
Energy and  Power.  She related  that this was also  supported by                                                               
the  REAP  board  during  discussions   about  looking  at  these                                                               
technologies  and not  limiting because  there  is a  lot on  the                                                               
horizon and  there needs to be  the ability to take  advantage of                                                               
everything.   This topic was  discussed before the  House Special                                                               
Committee  on Energy,  she noted,  and the  decision was  made to                                                               
have more conversation about it.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:59:49 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ALAN MITCHELL, Owner, Analysis  North, provided invited testimony                                                               
during the hearing on  HB 301.  He stated he  has been working on                                                               
technical and  economic analysis  of energy and  telecom projects                                                               
for over  30 years  in Alaska.   He displayed  the first  of four                                                               
slides,  "Preliminary Economic  Analysis  of  Railbelt RPS,"  and                                                               
noted that this  preliminary analysis was not done  for REAP, but                                                               
rather on  his own and no  payment was received from  anyone.  He                                                               
said he  agrees with Ms.  Estey about getting  NREL to do  a more                                                               
serious economic  analysis.   He explained  that NREL  mapped out                                                               
five  different routes  for achieving  the  80 percent  renewable                                                               
standard  in the  Railbelt  from which  he  picked [Scenario  3],                                                               
which predominantly  relies on  wind and  solar as  the renewable                                                               
means to get  to that 80 percent.   He said that  in his analysis                                                               
he did not  change anything in the  work NREL did, but  he went a                                                               
step further  by taking NREL's  results for how much  capacity of                                                               
wind  would be  needed to  achieve the  80 percent  and how  much                                                               
capacity of solar and assigning  some preliminary benefit in cost                                                               
numbers to that scenario.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MITCHELL proceeded  to  slide  2, "Preliminary  Benefit/Cost                                                               
Analysis,"  and explained  that the  graph  is a  summary of  the                                                               
benefits  and the  costs  that he  came  up with.    He said  his                                                               
estimate is $3.2  billion in capital cost  to implement [Scenario                                                               
3], and  his estimate is  $6.7 billion in present  value benefits                                                               
over the life  of these investments, which he estimates  to be 22                                                               
years.   He arrived at $6.7  billion, he explained, by  adding up                                                               
the fuel  savings, which were done  by NREL and which  he did not                                                               
modify, with proper discounting over  that 22-year life.  He said                                                               
he did reduce those fuel  savings somewhat by the added operating                                                               
and  maintenance  costs  of the  renewable  facilities  required.                                                               
Benefits far exceed  the costs, Mr. Mitchell stated,  and even if                                                               
the capital cost was doubled a net benefit would still be seen.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MITCHELL moved  to slide  3,  "Capital Costs  of Scenario  3                                                               
relative to Base Case," and  gave further detail on the estimated                                                               
capital costs.  He said  the right-most column of numbers depicts                                                               
the  total   cost  [in  billions]   for  each   renewable  energy                                                               
generation source  [wind - $2.34,  solar - $0.80, add  turbine to                                                               
Bradley  Lake -  $0.09,  biomass  - $0.22,  fossil  fuel    minus                                                               
$0.21,  totaling $3.24].   He  noted that  the bar  chart to  the                                                               
right  of those  numbers depicts  the relative  magnitude of  the                                                               
different  sources, and  the capital  costs  for this  wind-solar                                                               
scenario are  dominated by wind and  solar.  He pointed  out that                                                               
no  transmission  and battery  storage  costs  are in  the  table                                                               
because NREL  assumed that both transmission  and battery storage                                                               
would be built in the status  quo case, in the nonrenewable case,                                                               
and in all the renewable cases,  so it was a common investment to                                                               
everything.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MITCHELL  continued  reviewing  slide 3.    He  stated  that                                                               
Scenario 3  adds 802 megawatts  of wind,  but NREL did  not state                                                               
what that  would cost.   He  said he  therefore looked  at Golden                                                               
Valley Electric's Eva Creek Wind  Farm, brought online in 2012 at                                                               
a cost of  about $1.94 [per kilowatt], which was  a bit less than                                                               
twice the  cost per kilowatt  of the national average  wind farm.                                                               
He  took the  1.94 multiplier,  he explained,  and applied  it to                                                               
current  day national  average  wind costs,  so  his estimate  is                                                               
roughly twice the  current capital cost per kilowatt  for wind in                                                               
the Lower 48.  Similarly for  solar, he continued, he used a 1.46                                                               
multiplier,  which   is  consistent  with  the   publicly  stated                                                               
estimate of the proposed Homer Electric 20-megawatt solar farm.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MITCHELL  turned  to  slide   4,  "Benefits  that  were  Not                                                             
Considered in the Analysis."   He stated that several things make                                                               
his analysis on  the conservative side.  First,  while solar cost                                                               
has declined 85  percent since 2010 [adjusted  for inflation] and                                                               
wind cost has  declined 65 percent, he said his  analysis did not                                                               
assume any further decline in solar  and wind cost even though he                                                               
thinks there will  be and most of these  renewable investments to                                                               
implement Scenario 3 will occur 5-20  years from now.  Second, he                                                               
stated,  these renewable  projects are  going to  save fuel  well                                                               
past 2040,  but he did not  project fuel prices to  increase more                                                               
than just  the general  rate of inflation  beyond the  year 2040.                                                               
Further, he  continued, he  didn't take  any economic  credit for                                                               
the  reduced  carbon emissions  that  these  projects will  bring                                                               
about,  so he  didn't assume  that carbon  tax would  be avoided.                                                               
Finally, he  specified, he didn't  factor in any sort  of federal                                                               
subsidies  for  the  renewable  projects,  he  assumed  that  the                                                               
projects were entirely funded by Alaskans.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:07:46 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ERIN  MCKITTRICK,  Co-Founder,  Ground Truth  Trekking,  provided                                                               
invited testimony during  the hearing on HB 301.   She noted that                                                               
while she is a board  member of Homer Electric Association (HEA),                                                               
her testimony today is on behalf of  herself.  She said she has a                                                               
deep interest in energy and  has done independent analysis of the                                                               
Railbelt system  looking at such  things as the economics  of the                                                               
current  system and  carbon  emissions.   Having  a clean  energy                                                               
standard  is  important,  she  stressed,  and  good  for  Alaskan                                                               
consumers.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. MCKITTRICK  reviewed two graphs  to provide background.   She                                                               
stated that the Railbelt's generation  system hasn't changed much                                                               
in  the  last   decade  but  the  circumstances   around  it  are                                                               
different.   She  referred to  the graph  titled "Cook  Inlet Gas                                                               
usage" [for the  years 2000-2020] and said that when  lots of gas                                                               
was  being  produced  in  Cook  Inlet for  a  big  market,  which                                                               
included Agrium  and exports,  the local  users were  just "along                                                               
for the ride, almost an  afterthought."  A steep decline occurred                                                               
as that  became less  and less  economically viable,  she stated,                                                               
and now it is  down to a small market that  is mostly Enstar, the                                                               
electric utilities,  and the  oil and gas  industry itself.   She                                                               
referred  to  the  graph  titled  "State  Subsidies  vs.  Utility                                                               
Purchases of  Gas" and said  it looks  at the state  tax credits.                                                               
She pointed out  that when talking about the  current system, the                                                               
price of gas, and what is going  to happen in the future, it must                                                               
be  remembered that  steps have  already  been taken  to avert  a                                                               
local  energy crisis  with substantial  state money.   She  noted                                                               
that the yellow bars represent  $1.3 billion [in tax credits paid                                                               
by the state], and during  several years the state subsidies were                                                               
more than  what all  the utilities were  paying together.   While                                                               
there is  gas out  there, Ms. McKittrick  continued, it  might be                                                               
more costly to  get it to people.   The state may well  be on the                                                               
hook for  more rescues, she  said, and diversifying  fuel sources                                                               
and investing  in renewable energy projects  instead are tangible                                                               
things going  forward, given nobody  knows how long  the relative                                                               
price stabilization from those subsidies will last.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
4:11:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. MCKITTRICK  addressed earlier testimony about  the importance                                                               
of utilities  working together for  a better economy of  scale in                                                               
building  a project  that serves  more than  one utility.   Often                                                               
necessary in that coordination, she  said, is moving power around                                                               
between the different  utilities.  Transmission is  part of that,                                                               
she stated,  and she concurs  with the NREL  study's anticipation                                                               
that transmission  upgrades would be  necessary to reach  that 80                                                               
percent number.   She pointed  out that due  to lack of  time the                                                               
NREL  study did  not look  at lower,  more intermediate  targets.                                                               
She advised that lots of renewable  energy can be built, and that                                                               
power transferred  on the  grid as  it is  now, while  working on                                                               
building the other things.   For example, Ms. McKittrick related,                                                               
Homer Electric  Association has  a rule  of 50  percent renewable                                                               
energy by 2025  and anticipates that that is  possible before new                                                               
transmission  is  built.    She  further  pointed  out  that  the                                                               
constraints on  the current transmission  system aren't  true for                                                               
every  direction.   If  a line  is  full going  north  it is  not                                                               
necessarily  full going  south,  she explained,  so depending  on                                                               
where a  project is  put, a  lot of power  can be  transferred on                                                               
those  lines.   It isn't  necessary, she  continued, to  wait for                                                               
those transmission improvements to start down this path.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS. MCKITTRICK,  regarding the Bradley Lake  agreements affecting                                                               
transmission wheeling,  stated it is  important to have  a simple                                                               
unified  rate going  forward to  transfer  this renewable  energy                                                               
along existing  power lines.   She said she doesn't  know whether                                                               
it would  be necessary  to specifically  exclude Bradley  Lake to                                                               
avoid legal  conflicts, but she  imagines that it could  be done.                                                               
Bradley Lake,  she continued, is specifically  excluded from many                                                               
of  the things  she has  mentioned regarding  what could  be done                                                               
without destroying the  intent of freely moving  power from other                                                               
projects.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MS. MCKITTRICK  drew attention  to the  provision that  would let                                                               
utilities trade  credits for clean  power.  She stated  that this                                                               
works  between  the Railbelt  utilities,  but  the House  Special                                                               
Committee  on Energy's  CS modified  that to  be statewide.   She                                                               
offered her belief that the  intention was to potentially provide                                                               
some benefits  to rural  Alaska but  cautioned that,  as written,                                                               
the provision could have substantial  unintended consequences.  A                                                               
large amount of  renewable energy, she explained,  is produced by                                                               
about  nine  hydroelectric  projects   in  Southeast  Alaska  and                                                               
Kodiak, so if  any renewable energy in the state  could help meet                                                               
these goals there would be  incentive for those utilities to sell                                                               
those  credits  cheaply  and   it  wouldn't  necessarily  benefit                                                               
anyone.  Those  places have cheaper power than  the Railbelt, she                                                               
noted, and they  don't really need to build  more renewable power                                                               
themselves in  many cases  because they  already are  pretty much                                                               
running on  hydro.   Ms. McKittrick  suggested that  this problem                                                               
could be  solved by modifying the  credit system to be  either on                                                               
the Railbelt  or utilities that  are eligible for the  Power Cost                                                               
Equalization  (PCE) Program.   Those  are  small rural  utilities                                                               
with  high costs,  she added,  and  their total  amount of  power                                                               
generation  is much  smaller so  they could  sell credits  in the                                                               
Railbelt but still build projects.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:17:41 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. MCKITTRICK said looking at  costs is important and looking at                                                               
fuel savings is key because  current power generation [in Alaska]                                                               
is so expensive in many cases  that it might be possible to build                                                               
and operate a  renewable project for the fuel cost  of running an                                                               
existing plant.  Existing plants do  not have to be taken off the                                                               
books or dismantled,  she stated, it makes sense to  keep them as                                                               
backups when building new  more efficient nonrenewable generation                                                               
or building renewable  generation.  There is no need  to wait for                                                               
existing plants to be at the end of their lives, she added.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS  asked Ms. McKittrick  to provide  her suggestion                                                               
for credits by email to the committee.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
4:19:25 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MCCARTY  noted that  certain areas such  as Kodiak                                                               
have  more resources  and certain  areas  do not  have access  to                                                               
renewable energy.   He requested  comment on that  aspect because                                                               
it doesn't appear that one thing fits all.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS.  MCKITTRICK  responded  that  this standard  applies  to  the                                                               
Railbelt  which is  all tied  together and  has enough  renewable                                                               
resources to meet this.  She said  the credit system is a way, in                                                               
lieu of  meeting some  portion of that  standard, to  buy credits                                                               
from  another utility  elsewhere in  Alaska, so  presumably those                                                               
villages or  other areas  that had  access [to  renewables] could                                                               
sell those  credits.  This  bill would  not solve the  problem of                                                               
providing energy to  all villages, she continued;  it is intended                                                               
to  focus on  the  Railbelt  so doesn't  attempt  to answer  that                                                               
question  about  what  villages   with  no  access  to  renewable                                                               
resources should do.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:21:55 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
RYAN  JOHNSTON,  Staff,  Representative  Calvin  Schrage,  Alaska                                                               
State Legislature, presented the summary  of changes made in CSHB
301(ENE) on behalf of the House  Special Committee on Energy.  He                                                               
paraphrased  from the  document  in the  committee packet  titled                                                               
"Summary of Changes  for HB 301 (Version A to  W)," which read as                                                               
follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1,  Lines 1   3:  amends the title to  read "clean                                                                  
     energy  standard"  and  adds "relating  to  the  Alaska                                                                    
     Energy  Authority and  clean energy  projects;" to  the                                                                    
     title  of  the  bill.  The title  change  was  done  to                                                                    
     conform with  the "renewable portfolio"  standard being                                                                    
     replaced with a "clean" energy portfolio.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, Lines 9    11: after "energy resources" adds to                                                                  
     the purpose section of the  bill, "in order to minimize                                                                    
     costs  to consumers,  increase  stability for  economic                                                                    
     development,  maximize  grid resiliency,  and  minimize                                                                    
     the state's carbon emissions."                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1,  Line 14:  adds a new  section to  AS 42.05.381                                                                  
     that  directs the  Electrical Reliability  Organization                                                                    
     to  develop a  uniform transmission  services rate  for                                                                    
     the  transmission of  energy to  comply with  the clean                                                                    
     energy standard under AS 42.05.900.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR. JOHNSTON clarified that for  the new section to AS 42.05.381,                                                               
any energy transmission done from  the generation of clean energy                                                               
would  be covered  under that  transmission  tariff and  anything                                                               
existing currently  from normal production would  not be covered.                                                               
He continued paraphrasing from the summary of changes:                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Page  2, Line  15:  amends subsection  (B)  to be  more                                                                  
     aligned with utility industry language.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page  3,  Line  27      Page  4,  Line  3:  amends  the                                                                  
     benchmarks for  the clean energy standard  to from four                                                                    
     to three. The first being  25 [percent] by December 31,                                                                    
     2030.  The second  being 55  [percent] by  December 31,                                                                    
     2040.  And finally,  the third  being  80 [percent]  by                                                                    
     December 31,  2050. The third benchmark  was amended to                                                                    
     now only  be applied Railbelt  wide instead of  by each                                                                    
     utility.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     Page  4, Lines  18     23: adds  a  new  section to  AS                                                                  
     42.05.900 that  would allow  for construction  that has                                                                    
     begun prior  to the  end of a  compliance period  to be                                                                    
     counted to fulfilling the clean  energy standard if the                                                                    
     project will  begin providing energy no  later than two                                                                    
     years  after the  compliance  period or  the  end of  a                                                                    
     period  determined  by  the  Regulatory  Commission  of                                                                    
     Alaska.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. JOHNSTON explained that this  new section to AS 42.05.900 was                                                               
added to give  more leeway for larger  construction projects that                                                               
would potentially  happen so  the RCA would  have the  ability to                                                               
determine that time period.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:24:49 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FIELDS asked  whether  he is  correct in  understanding                                                               
that if the deadline  is 25 percent by 2030 and  there is a large                                                               
project  that would  get to  25 percent,  but it  is still  being                                                               
developed and not actually producing  by 2030, then the utilities                                                               
are meeting the requirements.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR. JOHNSTON that  is correct; technically if it  fell within the                                                               
two-year period it would be fine.   The gray area, he said, would                                                               
be if  it was going to  fall after the two-year  period, then the                                                               
utilities would  have to make  a case  with the RCA  to determine                                                               
the period of time in which it could comply.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. JOHNSTON continued paraphrasing from the summary of changes:                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Page  5, Line  2: adds  a new  section to  AS 42.05.900                                                                  
     stating  that a  load  serving entity  may satisfy  the                                                                    
     clean energy standard using clean energy credits.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Page  5, Line  4: adds  a new  section to  AS 42.05.900                                                                  
     that  a project  located wholly  or partially  on state                                                                    
     lands are exempted from state lease fees.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Page  5, Line  20: adds  a new  section to  empower the                                                                  
     Regulatory Commission  of Alaska to monitor  the effect                                                                    
     of the  clean energy standard on  rates and reliability                                                                    
     to determine if it if consistent with the public good.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Page 5, Line  23   Page 6, Line 4:  amends the previous                                                                  
     credit system into the "Clean  energy Credits". A clean                                                                    
     energy credit  may only be  used once. A credit  may be                                                                    
     used to  comply with the clean  energy standard without                                                                    
     purchasing  or use  of the  electrical generation  from                                                                    
     which the credit is derived.  The energy from which the                                                                    
     credit is  derived must  be generated  in the  State of                                                                    
     Alaska.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  JOHNSTON  pointed out  that  the  credits-based system  [was                                                               
changed in  the CS] to  focus on the  whole of Alaska  instead of                                                               
just the Railbelt as was provided in the original version.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS  referenced Ms.  McKittrick's comments  and asked                                                               
whether  current   language  states  that  existing   hydro  from                                                               
Southeast could  be counted or  whether new language needs  to be                                                               
added to clarify that this is only new generation.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MR. JOHNSTON  responded that under  current language it  could be                                                               
existing  or new  projects.    He related  that  there have  been                                                               
conversations  about potentially  scaling this  down because  the                                                               
intent  of the  amendment  was  to create  a  link between  rural                                                               
Alaska and the  Railbelt since the bill is so  heavily focused on                                                               
the Railbelt, and then creating  a credit system that would allow                                                               
a  revenue stream  for Alaska's  small rural  power producers  to                                                               
participate in a clean energy standard.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS stated  that that is a change  the committee will                                                               
need to  pursue.  The  idea, he said,  is that the  most economic                                                               
project might be  in Bethel or Southeast and  encouraging that is                                                               
wanted, but  to not  count everything that  is already  there and                                                               
thereby do nothing.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR. JOHNSTON continued paraphrasing from the summary of changes:                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Page  7, Line  6: after  "commission" changed  the word                                                                  
     "may" to "shall".                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Page 7, Lines  16   20: amends  the previous exemptions                                                                  
     section  to  a  single  exception.  The  new  exemption                                                                    
     states that  if the Railbelt achieves  the clean energy                                                                    
     standard than the individual  load serving entities are                                                                    
     exempted.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Page 7,  Lines 24   28:  adds a definition of  a "clean                                                                  
     energy credit".                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     Page 7,  Line 29: Amended the  definition of "renewable                                                                  
     energy  resource" and  renamed "clean  energy resource"                                                                    
     was cleaned up by legislative  legal to be more in line                                                                    
     with   their  drafting   standards  and   the  previous                                                                    
     committee added nuclear generation to the definition.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Page 8, Lines 6    8: amends the previous definition of                                                                  
     "renewable  energy  standard"  to be  a  "clean  energy                                                                    
     standard" and reordered it in the definitions section.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Page 8, Line 11: amends  the compliance period to a 10-                                                                  
     year period.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Page  8,  Line   26:  adds  a  new   subsection  to  AS                                                                  
     44.83.940. The  new subsection  would require  that the                                                                    
     Alaska Energy  Authority shall provide a  report to the                                                                    
     legislature every two years  on the progress developing                                                                    
     renewable and clean energy resources in rural parts of                                                                     
     the state.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Page 9,  Line 3: the  regulations language for  the RCA                                                                  
     of Alaska  was cleaned  up by  legislative legal  to be                                                                    
     more  in   line  with  their  drafting   standards  and                                                                    
     existing powers of the RCA.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:30:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SPOHNHOLZ  asked about the change  in nomenclature                                                               
from renewable energy  resource to clean energy  resource and why                                                               
"clean" is being used as opposed to "renewable."                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. JOHNSTON answered  that with the addition of  nuclear it made                                                               
more sense to set the  precedent with clean rather than renewable                                                               
because it is generally not  accepted that nuclear is a renewable                                                               
energy resource, but it is considered a clean energy resource.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR SPOHNHOLZ agreed that that makes sense.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. JOHNSTON  noted that NREL  recently provided a  cost estimate                                                               
and a  time period  breakdown, which  he will  pass along  to the                                                               
committee.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FIELDS  related that  the  House  Special Committee  on                                                               
Energy heard this bill extensively for about two months.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
[HB 301 was held over.]                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
            HB 382-INSULIN COVERAGE:INSURANCE;MEDICAID                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:32:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS announced  that the next order  of business would                                                               
be HOUSE  BILL NO.  382, "An Act  relating to  insurance coverage                                                               
for  pharmacy   services."    [Before  the   committee  was  CSHB
382(HSS).]                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:32:39 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SNYDER,  as  prime   sponsor,  stated  that  CSHB
382(HSS)  could  have immediate  and  meaningful  impacts to  the                                                               
pocketbooks of  Alaskans because it addresses  the astronomically                                                               
high cost of  insulin.  In 1996, she related,  the list price for                                                               
a vial of insulin was $21; today  that list price is about $300 -                                                               
four times  the cost  that would be  expected based  on inflation                                                               
alone.    She said  this  puts  many  folks  with diabetes  in  a                                                               
situation  where they  are  making choices  about  what they  can                                                               
spend  their  limited  household  income on  when  they  need  to                                                               
purchase insulin plus pay rent or buy food.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER  specified that about 49,000  Alaskans have                                                               
been  diagnosed  with  diabetes and  an  additional  15,000  have                                                               
diabetes  but don't  know it  yet.   Another  5,000 Alaskans  are                                                               
diagnosed with diabetes every year,  making it a growing problem.                                                               
About  34 percent  of Alaska's  adult  population, about  182,000                                                               
people,  have pre-diabetes.   So,  she added,  this bill  has the                                                               
potential  to   impact  a  significant  proportion   of  Alaska's                                                               
population.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER pointed  out that about 20  states now have                                                               
similar legislation.   In Minnesota, two  health insurers decided                                                               
independently  to cap  insulin costs  at  $25 a  month for  their                                                               
patients, and  Blue Cross/Blue Shield  has announced a  $0 co-pay                                                               
cap on insulin for its patients.   So, she continued, capping the                                                               
co-pay   is  becoming   an  important   mitigation  measure   for                                                               
Americans.   Medicare Part D plans  agreed to cap insulin  at $35                                                               
per month  starting in  2021.   This bill  is an  opportunity for                                                               
Alaskans  to  directly  feel this  same  benefit,  she  stressed.                                                               
Regarding  whether  capping  co-pays could  result  in  increased                                                               
insurance  premiums for  everyone,  she cited  the 2017  Milliman                                                               
Study which found  that the cost to provide the  benefit would be                                                               
about 70-95 cents per member per  year.  That doesn't account for                                                               
the potential  to reduce premiums overall,  Representative Snyder                                                               
continued,  because  better  managed  diabetes  through  improved                                                               
access to insulin decreases healthcare  costs associated with the                                                               
complications of  poorly managed  diabetes, such  as amputations.                                                               
She further noted  that in 2021 the state of  Washington voted to                                                               
cap its  insulin co-pays at  $100 a  month, which resulted  in an                                                               
average proposed  rate decrease of  almost 2 percent  within that                                                               
year.   Kentucky introduced an insulin  co-pay cap [at a  cost to                                                               
provide the benefit] of 7-24 cents  per person per month on fully                                                               
insured policies, and California is similar.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JAMES HOLZENBERG, Staff, Representative  Liz Snyder, Alaska State                                                               
Legislature, during the  hearing on HB 382,  explained the change                                                               
made in CSHB  382(HSS) on behalf of  Representative Snyder, prime                                                               
sponsor.  He  said the change was  on page 2, line  6, Section 2,                                                               
coverage  for treatment  of diabetes,  where the  proposed co-pay                                                               
cap was brought down to $35.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER  added that the  bill is an  opportunity to                                                               
make a small change to  something that affects many Alaskans, and                                                               
it  will have  a  long-term beneficial  impact  for all  Alaskans                                                               
regardless of whether they experience diabetes themselves.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS  noted that $35  is consistent with  other states                                                               
and pending federal legislation, hence the change.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:39:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MCCARTY  asked whether insulin could  be purchased                                                               
in bulk to bring down the price, as is being done in Utah.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER  replied that this opportunity  has not yet                                                               
been explored by  the Division of Insurance, but  it is something                                                               
that can  be pursued.  She  said the Utah program  has been going                                                               
for a  couple years  but there  is not yet  data on  its success.                                                               
She said she shares Representative  McCarty's interest in whether                                                               
this would be a good option for Alaska.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:40:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
LORI   WING-HEIER,  Director,   Division  of   Insurance,  Alaska                                                               
Department  of  Commerce,  Community,  and  Economic  Development                                                               
(DCCED),  replied  that  the House  Health  and  Social  Services                                                               
Standing  Committee   asked  the   division  about   the  Vaccine                                                               
Assessment Council.   The council, she explained,  is run through                                                               
the  Department of  Health and  Social Services  (DHSS), and  the                                                               
state buys  vaccines in  bulk and then  the providers  access the                                                               
vaccines  from the  state to  get  the lowest  cost possible  for                                                               
vaccines for  children, infants,  and adults.   She  related that                                                               
DHSS has responded  that it could look at  the Vaccine Assessment                                                               
Council much  like looking  at the  Utah program,  but it  is not                                                               
addressed in  this legislation and would  need to be taken  up in                                                               
another bill at another date to  either mirror what Utah has done                                                               
or look at Alaska's own resources.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MCCARTY  inquired  whether DHSS  could  do  this,                                                               
provided insulin  could be  purchased in  bulk, rather  than wait                                                               
for a statute change.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS.  WING-HEIER deferred  to DHSS  to answer  the question.   She                                                               
offered her belief that when  DHSS was before the other committee                                                               
the department  said it did  need the legislation and  would need                                                               
to do  an analysis  to see what  it would take  to bring  it into                                                               
Alaska as a bulk purchase.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:42:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KAUFMAN inquired  about the  root cause  for high                                                               
insulin prices.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SNYDER replied  that  while  there are  different                                                               
forms of insulin, different ways  of delivering it, and different                                                               
manufacturers, there are no cheaper  generic options for insulin.                                                               
So, she said,  it opens the door for  pharmaceutical companies to                                                               
charge ever increasing  prices, which has happened  over the past                                                               
several decades because individuals need insulin to survive.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KAUFMAN  surmised  that "if  we're  not  actually                                                               
affecting the  price, then what  we're left with  is distributing                                                               
the cost across the system."                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SNYDER stated  that this  bill is  not where  she                                                               
would like  to stop with this  issue.  She agreed  that initially                                                               
it  is distributing  the  cost but  that  various studies  across                                                               
multiple states show  it is very minimal and is  a net savings to                                                               
everyone due to lower costs  associated with hospitalizations and                                                               
adverse  impacts  associated  with uncontrolled  diabetes.    She                                                               
argued  that  passing legislation  on  co-pay  will motivate  the                                                               
insurance  companies  to  put   pressure  on  the  pharmaceutical                                                               
companies to drive down those costs.   She related that there has                                                               
not been  pushback on  the bill  except for  one letter  from the                                                               
Association for  Health Insurance  Providers (AHIP), which  is in                                                               
the committee packet.  She said  the letter identifies a range of                                                               
other things that  can also be done, with which  she agrees, such                                                               
as  improving  drug  pricing transparency  and  banning  pay  for                                                               
delay.  She  explained that banning pay for delay  has to do with                                                               
companies  paying other  pharmaceutical  companies  to delay  the                                                               
release  of  generic  options.    However,  she  continued,  that                                                               
doesn't  really  apply  here  for diabetes,  so  there  are  some                                                               
challenging  recommendations in  this single  letter that  aren't                                                               
quite transparent or accurate.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS  noted that  he asked about  root cause  when the                                                               
bill  was before  the  House Health  &  Social Services  Standing                                                               
Committee.  He  said the pharmaceutical companies  are engaged in                                                               
price gouging and he understands  the administration is exploring                                                               
action through  the attorney general's  office because  the price                                                               
increases far  exceed anything that could  possibly be attributed                                                               
to production costs.  He  expressed his support for investigation                                                               
and follow-up by the attorney general.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KAUFMAN submitted  that  capping  the co-pay  and                                                               
spreading  the cost  across all  insurance  subscribers does  not                                                               
result  in downward  pressure because  the  insurance company  is                                                               
flexible and can  share those costs and it  doesn't transmit back                                                               
to the insulin manufacturer.   He asked whether a mechanism could                                                               
be put into the  bill so it would not be a  cost sharing bill but                                                               
would instead apply downward pressure.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SNYDER answered  that she  would look  forward to                                                               
exploring such  an amendment  with Representative  Kaufman either                                                               
in this committee or ahead of the floor.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR SPOHNHOLZ offered her appreciation  for the sentiment in                                                               
Representative Kaufman's  questions.   She related that  when the                                                               
bill was  before the  House Health  and Social  Services Standing                                                               
Committee it was learned that this  is a case of making sure that                                                               
people  are getting  their insulin  and not  rationing this  life                                                               
saving medication.  She pointed out  that in addition to the cost                                                               
savings  of 70-95  cents per  member per  year identified  in the                                                               
2017 Milliman Study,  there is a net increase  in productivity of                                                               
the  Americans who  receive access  to this  care and  not having                                                               
amputations, becoming blind, or having ulcers.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER  confirmed that the statements  by Co-Chair                                                               
Spohnholz  are  in  the  ballpark.   She  said  data  shows  that                                                               
irregular insulin  use can increase  in-patient hospital  cost by                                                               
up to 41 percent.  A  common issue associated with poorly managed                                                               
diabetes, she  explained, is  foot ulcers.   The charge  per foot                                                               
ulcer can  be up to $17,000  per ulcer, which if  not treated can                                                               
lead  to  amputation,  a horrendous  and  horrendously  expensive                                                               
experience.   Another complication,  she continued, is  end stage                                                               
renal  disease and  the price  tag  for complications  associated                                                               
with  that.   She said  she agrees  that there  is an  additional                                                               
opportunity  to deal  with  the  high prices  coming  out of  the                                                               
pharmaceutical industry  itself, but that  a co-pay cap  can have                                                               
an  initial first  and quick  reduction in  expenses to  both the                                                               
individual with diabetes and those sharing a plan.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:50:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS opened public testimony on CSHB 382(HSS).                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:50:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
LAURA KELLER,  American Diabetes Association (ADA),  testified in                                                               
support of CSHB 382(HSS).  She  confirmed that many levers can be                                                               
pulled throughout  the chain to  address the cost  of medications                                                               
like insulin.  However, she advised  that as a person with type 1                                                               
diabetes, there is  no other option and people  are rationing and                                                               
they are dying because they do  not have access to the lifesaving                                                               
medication.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. KELLER  said ADA is urging  the committee to act  now because                                                               
this helps  people with  insurance, which is  a great  first step                                                               
that makes a  difference in people's lives.  She  stated that the                                                               
Utah scenario  would be a great  secondary thing to do  and would                                                               
impact people who don't have  health insurance.  She related that                                                               
a non-partisan  study in California  showed that with  an insulin                                                               
co-pay cap  a state can reduce  diabetes related hospitalizations                                                               
by  10  percent  in  the  first couple  years  after  the  bill's                                                               
passage,  and there  will be  other savings  to the  state.   She                                                               
stressed that people with diabetes  need the insulin, there is no                                                               
other option.   She pointed out that the insulin  used in insulin                                                               
pumps ranges from  $3-$7 a vial, which includes  a company making                                                               
back its research  and development and marketing.   So, she said,                                                               
this situation is different than many other medications.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:52:40 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS  closed public testimony after  ascertaining that                                                               
no one else wished to testify.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:52:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   MCCARTY  offered   his   understanding  that   a                                                               
medication goes generic  after being around for seven  years.  He                                                               
asked whether  there is  generic insulin  given that  insulin has                                                               
been around a long time.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS.  KELLER replied  that there  is  not generic  insulin on  the                                                               
market currently.   She explained  that the companies  which make                                                               
insulin have rebranded  some of their insulin to  be considered a                                                               
generic.  While  it is the exact same product  and the exact same                                                               
manufacturers,  she  continued,  those  generic  medications  are                                                               
priced very similarly and therefore still not a co-pay of $25.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   MCCARTY  referenced   the  US   Food  and   Drug                                                               
Administration  (FDA) and  asked whether  cheaper insulin  can be                                                               
found outside the US.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS.  KELLER responded  that  the  FDA is  looking  at some  "bio-                                                               
similars" and other options of  potentially generic insulins, but                                                               
nothing has  been approved  into the  market yet.   She  said the                                                               
insulin  under discussion  can be  purchased in  other countries,                                                               
such as Canada and Mexico, and  they are the exact same brand and                                                               
formula  at a  much-reduced  cost.   But,  she explained,  health                                                               
insurance is currently  unable to provide those  insulins in that                                                               
way because the FDA and  the federal government have not approved                                                               
that through proper channels.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MCCARTY said  he has heard that the  State of Utah                                                               
sends employees to Mexico for medication.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MS. KELLER offered  her belief that that is correct  but said she                                                               
is unfamiliar with  how Utah does that and the  cost that Utah is                                                               
paying.   She noted that  she worked with the  representative for                                                               
the  Insulin  Utah  Purchasing Program  which  allows  people  to                                                               
purchase for  the same price as  the employee price in  the state                                                               
of Utah.   That program has been very  successful, she continued,                                                               
and it is a completely online program.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FIELDS  said he  hopes  the  Department of  Health  and                                                               
Social  Services will  continue examining  how to  obtain insulin                                                               
directly from Canada and bypass "pharma" to get lower prices.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
4:55:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SPOHNHOLZ moved  to report  CSHB 382(HSS)  out of                                                               
committee  with individual  recommendations and  the accompanying                                                               
fiscal notes.  There being  no objection, CSHB 382(HSS) was moved                                                               
out of the House Labor and Commerce Standing Committee.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
         SB 190-REGULATORY COMMISSION AK/REFUSE UTILITIES                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
4:56:32 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS announced  that the next order  of business would                                                               
be  CS  FOR SENATE  BILL  NO.  190(FIN),  "An Act  extending  the                                                               
termination  date   of  the  Regulatory  Commission   of  Alaska;                                                               
relating   to  Regulatory   Commission   of  Alaska   regulations                                                               
regarding refuse utilities; relating to  the powers and duties of                                                               
the legislative  audit division;  and providing for  an effective                                                               
date."                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FIELDS moved  to adopt  Amendment 1  to CSSB  190(FIN),                                                               
labeled 32-LS1525\W.2, Radford/Ambrose, 4/28/22, which read:                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 3, following "division;":                                                                                   
          Insert "relating to the privatization of refuse                                                                     
     utilities;"                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, following line 8:                                                                                                  
     Insert a new bill section to read:                                                                                         
        "* Sec. 3.  AS 42.05.641 is amended by  adding a new                                                                
     subsection to read:                                                                                                        
          (b)  A municipality that seeks to privatize a                                                                         
     municipal  refuse  utility  that   is  subject  to  the                                                                    
     provisions of  this chapter shall submit  a proposal to                                                                    
     the commission  for review. The commission  may approve                                                                    
     the   proposal    if   the   commission    finds   that                                                                    
     privatization  will  not  result in  higher  rates  for                                                                    
     consumers  and  that  privatization is  in  the  public                                                                    
     interest. A privatization proposal must include                                                                            
               (1)     a  business   plan  that   lists  the                                                                    
     prospective vendors;                                                                                                       
               (2)  the projected  cost of private operation                                                                    
     compared to  continued municipal  operation for  a ten-                                                                    
     year period;                                                                                                               
               (3)   disclosure  of any  potential conflicts                                                                    
     of interest on the part of municipal officials; and                                                                        
               (4)  proposed methods                                                                                            
               (A)      for  periodically   evaluating   the                                                                    
     utility's  performance  to   avoid  diminished  service                                                                    
     quality,  interruption,  or  stoppage of  work  by  the                                                                    
     contractor;                                                                                                                
               (B)       to   encourage    competition   and                                                                    
     productivity;                                                                                                              
               (C)   for monitoring  a contract in  order to                                                                    
     detect any contractor  defaults, monitor penalties, and                                                                    
     prepare  for contract  renewals  or renegotiations  and                                                                    
     inflation; and                                                                                                             
               (D)      to    address   municipal   employee                                                                    
     displacement."                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     Renumber the following bill sections accordingly.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR SPOHNHOLZ objected for purposes of explanation.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS  recalled that including refuse  utilities in the                                                               
Regulatory  Commission  of  Alaska  (RCA) was  discussed  at  the                                                               
previous bill  hearing.   He said  a consolidated  review process                                                               
makes a  lot of  sense, and  given the  underlying bill  looks at                                                               
refuse  utilities  it  also  makes sense  to  add  some  consumer                                                               
safeguards;  for  example,  a   municipality  decides  to  change                                                               
governance of  the refuse utility.   These proposed  changes were                                                               
suggested  by  the  Alaska Public  Interest  Research  Group,  he                                                               
continued,  so Amendment  1  does not  prohibit  or require,  nor                                                               
encourage or discourage privatization, but  it does say that if a                                                               
municipality is going to privatizes  a refuse utility there needs                                                               
to be  an RCA  review to ensure  the proposed  privatization will                                                               
not  raise  cost  for  consumers  beyond  those  which  would  be                                                               
incurred under the existing governance structure.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
4:58:24 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE KAUFMAN  expressed concern that Amendment  1 would                                                               
preempt.   He  said that  if  the utility  has been  part of  the                                                               
municipality  it  may  not  represent   good  allocation  of  the                                                               
operation,  maintenance,  and other  costs.    So, he  continued,                                                               
regarding the clause that it will  not result in higher rates for                                                               
consumers,  the rates  that  were being  charged  were maybe  not                                                               
realistic.  Putting a lid on  it, he argued, would make it nearly                                                               
impossible to determine the market value of the services.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS replied that it  is not his intent to arbitrarily                                                               
cap rates at a point in time.   He said his assumption is that in                                                               
doing  this  analysis the  RCA  could  analyze the  actual  costs                                                               
incurred by  a municipality and  what the  costs would be  over a                                                               
reasonable time  horizon versus what  the costs would be  under a                                                               
proposed privatization.   He requested  an RCA  representative to                                                               
address whether  the RCA would have  the ability to look  at what                                                               
price escalation  would be under an  existing municipal structure                                                               
versus  potential price  escalation under  a proposed  privatized                                                               
structure.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:59:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ROBERT  "BOB" PICKETT,  Chair,  Regulatory  Commission of  Alaska                                                               
(RCA), responded  that the amendment raised  some legal questions                                                               
concerning the rest  of Alaska's statutes when he saw  it for the                                                               
first time this morning, so  he immediately asked Stuart Goering,                                                               
Assistant Attorney General,  to read the amendment.   Mr. Pickett                                                               
stated  that  it would  be  very  difficult for  a  non-regulated                                                               
municipal utility  to do that  because there is a  wide variation                                                               
in  how municipalities  handle their  accounting  practices.   He                                                               
further stated that  if a municipality is  subsidizing the refuse                                                               
service,  it  gets  into intergovernmental  cost  charges,  which                                                               
different  entities handle  differently.   He  clarified that  he                                                               
isn't  saying  it's impossible,  but  that  there would  be  some                                                               
challenges in  trying to project  a regulatory framework  onto an                                                               
entity that  isn't regulated  to do  this analysis  and determine                                                               
whether it is  ultimately going to be in the  benefit of the rate                                                               
payers.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS  asked what would  prevent the RCA from  asking a                                                               
municipality what the costs are  of providing a refuse collection                                                               
service and  what the municipality  anticipates those  costs will                                                               
be over a 10-year period, as provided in the amendment.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. PICKETT answered  that when going through rate  cases and the                                                               
schedules that  are required to  make those assessments,  it gets                                                               
into  the nature  of the  municipality and  how the  municipality                                                               
handles  its accounting  practices.   Plus, he  added, there  are                                                               
some legal issues involved with that too.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FIELDS  invited  Mr.   Goering  to  address  the  legal                                                               
concerns.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
5:02:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
STUART  GOERING,  Assistant  Attorney General,  Commercial,  Fair                                                               
Business and  Child Support Section, Civil  Division (Anchorage),                                                               
Department  of Law,  responded that  there are  several different                                                               
issues from a  regulatory perspective.  He explained  that to his                                                               
knowledge there  are no  economically regulated  municipal refuse                                                               
utilities  in Alaska  right now.   All  municipalities that  have                                                               
certificates, he  said, are exempt under  either AS 42.05.711(b),                                                               
which is the  exception for political subdivisions  of the state,                                                               
or AS 42.05.711(d), which is  the Municipality of Anchorage Solid                                                               
Waste  Services.   He stated  this means  that the  RCA does  not                                                               
specify  any  of  the economic  conditions  of  a  municipality's                                                               
operations,  which   includes  that   the  RCA  doesn't   tell  a                                                               
municipality how to do accounting,  there is no uniform system of                                                               
accounts, there  is no uniform  depreciation schedule,  and there                                                               
is  no   cost  allocation  manual  for   the  other  governmental                                                               
operations to  share costs with  the utility.   As a  result, Mr.                                                               
Goering  continued, the  RCA  has no  previous  knowledge of  the                                                               
economics of any of the  municipal waste collection utilities [in                                                               
Alaska].   That is  the background, he  noted, for  Mr. Pickett's                                                               
response  that it  would be  extremely difficult  because without                                                               
that information the RCA would be doing that from scratch.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. GOERING  stated that even  with a regulated utility  that has                                                               
been keeping  its books  and records  in the  proper form  for an                                                               
economically  regulated  utility,  and  with a  long  history  of                                                               
economic regulation, rate  cases often take multiple  years.  The                                                               
timeline for  those is 540  days, he  said, and can  sometimes go                                                               
longer with  extensions that the  parties ask for because  of the                                                               
complications  with the  cases.   So,  he continued,  it isn't  a                                                               
simple  matter to  step into  the middle  of something  which has                                                               
been operating for potentially since  statehood in some cases and                                                               
try  to figure  out the  economics of  the operation  without any                                                               
background  at all,  and that  is  where some  of the  difficulty                                                               
would come  in for  the RCA.   He said he  can address  the legal                                                               
issues if the committee wishes.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FIELDS  said  he  understands that  the  RCA  would  be                                                               
requesting  new information  since the  bill brings  in some  new                                                               
responsibilities and that is why Amendment 1 was introduced.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
5:05:12 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SCHRAGE noted that  the bill adds refuse utilities                                                               
under the  RCA regulations  without this  amendment passing.   He                                                               
asked whether  there are legal  concerns with bringing  in refuse                                                               
utilities under the  RCA and/or hurdles in  drafting and creating                                                               
regulations  related  to  refuse  utilities  given  the  lack  of                                                               
experience regulating such utilities.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. GOERING answered that the bill  does not bring refuse in as a                                                               
regulated  utility  for  the  first   time;  refuse  has  been  a                                                               
regulated utility class for a long  time.  He said Amendment 1 is                                                               
different  from  the  rest  of  the bill  in  that  it  addresses                                                               
municipal  refuse utilities;  the  rest of  the  bill relates  to                                                               
economically regulated refuse utilities  that are privately owned                                                               
and  must  follow the  RCA's  regulations  on uniform  system  of                                                               
accounts and  must file periodic  rate cases.  He  explained that                                                               
the other part of the bill,  which is being referred to, modifies                                                               
AS 42.05.381  to change the  way that  those rates are  made, not                                                               
assign responsibility for making those  rates in the first place.                                                               
So, Mr. Goering  continued, that part of the  bill would simplify                                                               
the process rather than making  it more complicated, but it would                                                               
not  remove  any  of  the background  information  that  the  RCA                                                               
currently gets  in the form  of annual reports,  which municipals                                                               
don't  file,  and periodic  rate  cases,  which municipals  don't                                                               
file.  So,  he stated, they really are two  separate issues - the                                                               
RCA  is already  regulating refuse  utilities, but  not municipal                                                               
refuse utilities.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
5:07:01 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE NELSON  said he is  always hesitant to  add policy                                                               
to a  simple extension  of the termination  date of  a regulatory                                                               
commission.   He  asked  whether  the bill  sponsor  has taken  a                                                               
position on Amendment 1.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR ROBERT MYERS, Alaska State  Legislature, prime sponsor of                                                               
CSSB  190(FIN),  answered  that  he  received  the  amendment  on                                                               
[4/29/22] and  is still  figuring out  what Amendment  1 entails.                                                               
He said he  isn't sure one way  or the other and  was planning to                                                               
defer to the RCA's expertise.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS  offered his appreciation for  the perspective of                                                               
the RCA  and Department of Law,  as well as his  appreciation for                                                               
Senator Myers  trying to  address refuse utilities.   The  RCA is                                                               
very capable  and able to  analyze complex information,  he said,                                                               
and the  information from refuse  utilities is less  complex than                                                               
that of electric utilities which the RCA deals with.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR SPOHNHOLZ  removed her  objection to  Amendment 1.   She                                                               
said that while it  would require work on the part  of the RCA to                                                               
clearly define  and measure cost  centers, one of the  RCA's jobs                                                               
is  to   ensure  there  aren't  unnecessary   rate  increases  to                                                               
Alaskans.   The RCA  is capable  of incredibly  complex oversight                                                               
and analysis, she added.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
5:08:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE KAUFMAN objected to Amendment 1.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
5:08:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
A roll call  vote was taken.   Representatives Fields, Spohnholz,                                                               
and  Snyder voted  in  favor  of Amendment  1  to CSSB  190(FIN).                                                               
Representatives  Kaufman,  Schrage,  McCarty,  and  Nelson  voted                                                               
against it.   Therefore, Amendment  1 to CSSB 190(FIN)  failed to                                                               
be adopted by a vote of 3-4.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
[CSSB 190(FIN) was held over.]                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
^CONFIRMATION HEARING(S):                                                                                                       
                    CONFIRMATION HEARING(S):                                                                                
^Department of Commerce, Community, & Economic Development                                                                      
   Department of Commerce, Community, & Economic Development                                                                
^Alcoholic Beverage Control Board                                                                                               
                Alcoholic Beverage Control Board                                                                            
^State Board of Registration for  Architects, Engineers, and Land                                                               
Surveyors                                                                                                                       
State Board  of Registration for Architects,  Engineers, and Land                                                           
Surveyors                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
^Board of Chiropractic Examiners                                                                                                
                Board of Chiropractic Examiners                                                                             
^Board of Examiners in Optometry                                                                                                
                 Board of Examiners in Optometry                                                                            
^Board of Dental Examiners                                                                                                      
                    Board of Dental Examiners                                                                               
^Board of Massage Therapists                                                                                                    
                   Board of Massage Therapists                                                                              
^Alaska Labor Relations Agency                                                                                                  
                  Alaska Labor Relations Agency                                                                             
^Marijuana Control Board                                                                                                        
                     Marijuana Control Board                                                                                
^Board of Marital and Family Therapy                                                                                            
               Board Of Marital and Family Therapy                                                                          
^Board of Direct Entry Midwives                                                                                                 
                  Board Of Direct Entry Midwives                                                                            
^Board of Nursing                                                                                                               
                         Board of Nursing                                                                                   
^Board of Pharmacy                                                                                                              
                        Board of Pharmacy                                                                                   
^Alaska State Board of Public Accountancy                                                                                       
             Alaska State Board of Public Accountancy                                                                       
^Board of Certified Real Estate Appraisers                                                                                      
            Board of Certified Real Estate Appraisers                                                                       
^Real Estate Commission                                                                                                         
                      Real Estate Commission                                                                                
^Board of Social Work Examiners                                                                                                 
                  Board of Social Work Examiners                                                                            
^Board of Veterinary Examiners                                                                                                  
                  Board of Veterinary Examiners                                                                             
^Alaska Workers' Compensation Board                                                                                             
                Alaska Workers' Compensation Board                                                                          
^Workers' Compensation Appeal Commission                                                                                        
             Workers' Compensation Appeal Commission                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
5:10:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS announced that the  final order of business would                                                               
be  the confirmation  hearings on  the  governor's appointees  to                                                               
various boards and commissions.   [The confirmation hearings were                                                               
begun at several previous meetings and were held over.]                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
5:10:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FIELDS  stated  that   the  House  Labor  and  Commerce                                                               
Standing  Committee  has  reviewed   the  qualifications  of  the                                                               
governors  appointees  and  recommends  the  following  names  be                                                               
forwarded to the  joint session for consideration:   Julie Sande,                                                               
Commissioner,  Department of  Commerce,  Community, and  Economic                                                               
Development; Douglas  Moore and  Janice Hill,  Alcoholic Beverage                                                               
Control Board;  Sterling Strait  and Brent  Cole, State  Board of                                                               
Registration  for  Architects,  Engineers,  and  Land  Surveyors;                                                               
Walter Campbell,  DC, Board  of Chiropractic  Examiners; Kathleen                                                               
Rice, OD, Board of Examiners  in Optometry; Dominic Wenzell, DMD,                                                               
Board of  Dental Examiners;  Kelli Shew,  LMT and  Amanda Nosich,                                                               
LMT, Board  of Massage Therapists;  Paula Harrison,  Alaska Labor                                                               
Relations  Agency;  Bruce Schulte,  Eliza  Muse,  and Ely  Cyrus,                                                               
Marijuana  Control   Board;  Tristian  Monterastelli,   Board  of                                                               
Marital and  Family Therapy;  Hanna St.  George, Board  of Direct                                                               
Entry  Midwives; Lena  Lafferty and  Jody Miller,  LPN, Board  of                                                               
Nursing;  Ashley Schaber,  PharmD,  MBA, BCPS,  and Ramsey  Bell,                                                               
RPh, Board of  Pharmacy; Elizabeth Stuart, Alaska  State Board of                                                               
Public  Accountancy;  Valery  Kudryn,  Board  of  Certified  Real                                                               
Estate  Appraisers; Devon  (Thomas) Doran  and Chad  Stigen, Real                                                               
Estate  Commission; Gabriel  King and  Sharon Woodward,  Board of                                                               
Social Work  Examiners; Ciara Vollaro,  DVM, Board  of Veterinary                                                               
Examiners;  Brad  Austin,  Christopher Dean,  Randy  Beltz,  Matt                                                               
Martin, Matthew  Barth, Michael Dennis, Sara  Faulkner, and Sarah                                                               
LeFebvre,  Alaska   Workers'  Compensation  Board;   and  Stephen                                                               
Hagedorn, Workers' Compensation Appeals Commission.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FIELDS   stated  that  signing  the   report  regarding                                                               
appointments  to boards  and commissions  in no  way reflects  an                                                               
individual  member's approval  or disapproval  of the  appointee.                                                               
The nomination  is merely forwarded  to the full  legislature for                                                               
confirmation or objection.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
5:11:48 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The committee took a brief at-ease.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
5:11:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
There being no  further business before the  committee, the House                                                               
Labor and  Commerce Standing Committee  meeting was  adjourned at                                                               
5:12 p.m.                                                                                                                       

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
HB 301 Transmittal Letter 2.1.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301
HB 301 Ver. A 2.4.22.PDF HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301
HB 301 CS (Energy) ver W. 4.29.22.PDF HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301
HB 301 Sectional Analysis Ver A 2.1.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301
HB 301 Summary of Changes ver A to ver W 5.2.2022.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301
HB 301 Fiscal Note DCCED - RCA 2.1.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301
HB 301 Analysis North Presentation 5.2.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301
HB 301 REAP Presentation 5.2.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301
HB 301 Supporting Docment - RPS&CES Country-Wide Breakdown 5.2.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301
HB 301 Supporting Document - Other State Benchmarks and Statutes 5.2.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301
SB 190 Amendment #1 - Fields 4.29.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
SB 190
SB 190 Testimony - AKPIRG 4.29.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
SB 190
HB 382 Version A 4.29.22.PDF HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 382
CSHB 382 Version B 4.29.22.PDF HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 382
HB 382 Sectional Analysis Ver. B 4.29.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 382
HB 382 Sponsor Statement Version B 4.29.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 382
HB 382 Summary of Changes Version B 4.29.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 382
HB 382 Support Document - ADA Insulin Fact Sheet 4.29.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 382
HB 382 Letter of Opposition - AHIP 4.29.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 382
HB 382 Kentucky Fiscal Note 4.29.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 382
HB 382 Research - Health Care Cost Institute Study on Spending on Individuals With Type 1 Diabetes 4.29.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 382
HB 382 Support Document - ADA Alaska Diabetes Fact Sheet 4.29.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 382
HB 301 Testimony Document - Erin Mckittrick 5.2.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301
HB 301 Testimony Document 2 - Erin Mckittrick 5.2.22.pdf HL&C 5/2/2022 3:15:00 PM
HB 301